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On 08/09/2011 02:34 PM, Mario Pavelic wrote:
> On 9.8.2011 13:17, Danijel Turina wrote:
>
>> Bojim se da ljudi na zapadu malo znaju o tim stvarima pa treba poraditi
>> na informiranju.
>
> Video od prije 4 godine:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI5WoXpmPiM
>
> Ili ovo prije 3 godine (Welcome to Saudi Britain):
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ox2-Wun2dIg
>
> Zalosno je da zapadnjaci nemaju pojma o Islamu i muslimanima...

Ma da, imaš hrpu liberala koji su indoktrinirani na razini refleksa
odbaciti svaku "diskriminaciju", po sistemu, svi su jednaki, svi su
super, sve je dobro. Osim, naravno, netolerantnih i diskriminirajućih
ljudi koje treba odmah staviti u zatvor ili pobiti. :)

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On 08/09/2011 01:44 PM, ALG wrote:
> Sreća da si u debeloj manjini a zatvorskh mjesta je još uvijek skroz
> dovoljno. ;-)

Sjeti se mene kad ti musliman prereže grlo.

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On 08/09/2011 01:43 PM, ALG wrote:
>>>
>>> Na takav način podatke "proučavaju" i deda, i pinp, i onaj ubojica iz
>>> norveške, i KKK, i alkajda itd.
>>
>> To je zato što su ti podaci neupitne činjenice i svatko ih mora
>> prihvatiti ako želi načiniti smislenu analizu. Kako netko reče, svatko
>> ima pravo na svoje mišljenje, ali nema pravo na svoje činjenice.
>>
>
> Onima s takvim činjenicama je mjesto jedino u najdubljoj zatvorskoj
> ćeliji u blažoj varijanti, a pred zidom u realnoj.

Fanatici su se uvijek borili protiv činjenica, to nije ništa novo.

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On 08/09/2011 01:55 PM, plastisa wrote:
> On Tue, 09 Aug 2011 13:41:30 +0200, Danijel Turina wrote:
>
>>> Jesi li bio u Istambulu ? Ja jesam, nedugo. Odmah do mog hotela usred grada
>>> lijepi, mali katolicki centar, tisuce ljudi (domacih, turista) prolazi tamo
>>> svaki dan, nisam primijetio da ikome ista smeta.
>
>> To ti je slaba logika, naime moj kolega je sad prije par dana bio u
>> Londonu i primjetio je veliki broj svakakvih manjina i činilo se da sve
>> to dobro funkcionira, a dan nakon što je došao doma su spalili pola
>> Londona. Dakle to što si ti vidio i što se tebi čini možeš okačiti mačku
>> o rep.
>
> Dakle, istina je u linkovima kojima me snabdijevas, a ono sto sam ja vidio
> i dozivio u principu mogu zanemariti :-) ?

Tako je. Naime linkovi koje sam pokazao su rezultat dubljeg uvida u
problematiku od onog koji netko može steći na temelju površnog
turističkog posjeta. To ti je isto kao da uspoređuješ svoj dojam o
cedeviti na temelju toga što si je pio, i laboratorijsku analizu
sadržaja na etiketi.

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On 08/09/2011 01:38 PM, ALG wrote:
> Kad čitam ove tvoje beastoće dođe mi da ti se u inat prebacim na islam :-)

Bedastoće o islamu sam vidio jedino kod "multikulturalnih liberala".

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On 08/09/2011 01:50 PM, plastisa wrote:
> Jesi li bio u Istambulu ? Ja jesam, nedugo. Odmah do mog hotela usred grada
> lijepi, mali katolicki centar, tisuce ljudi (domacih, turista) prolazi tamo
> svaki dan, nisam primijetio da ikome ista smeta.

To ti je slaba logika, naime moj kolega je sad prije par dana bio u
Londonu i primjetio je veliki broj svakakvih manjina i činilo se da sve
to dobro funkcionira, a dan nakon što je došao doma su spalili pola
Londona. Dakle to što si ti vidio i što se tebi čini možeš okačiti mačku
o rep.

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On 08/09/2011 01:25 PM, ALG wrote:
> On 9.8.2011. 13:18, Danijel Turina wrote:
>> On 08/09/2011 01:06 PM, ALG wrote:
>>>
>>> Očito imaš nešto osobno protiv muslimana pa izmišljaš ovakve bedastoće.
>>
>> Apsolutno ništa. Pišem samo ono što na temelju proučavanja podataka
>> smatram istinitim. Nikakvih osobnih koloracija tu nema.
>>
>
> Na takav način podatke "proučavaju" i deda, i pinp, i onaj ubojica iz
> norveške, i KKK, i alkajda itd.

To je zato što su ti podaci neupitne činjenice i svatko ih mora
prihvatiti ako želi načiniti smislenu analizu. Kako netko reče, svatko
ima pravo na svoje mišljenje, ali nema pravo na svoje činjenice.

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On 08/09/2011 01:28 PM, plastisa wrote:
>> > Ne, točno je tako kako sam rekao i dokazi upravo bodu u oči. Pogledaj si
>> > bilo koju islamsku zemlju pa mi reci gdje je tamo multikulturalnost.
> U Istambulu recimo.

Turska je loš primjer budući da je Ataturk tamo stavio islam na lanac,
ali svejedno je situacija dalako od idealne. Dakle Turska je islamska
zemlja onoliko koliko je Hrvatska katolička zemlja, ako ne manje.
Svejedno, stanje je daleko od idealnog, i zadnjih godina postoji
opasnost od dolaska islamista na vlast.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_religion_in_Turkey
Turkey is a secular country per Article 24 of the Turkish Constitution.
Secularism in Turkey originates from Atatürk's 'Six Arrows' of
Republicanism, Populism, Laïcité, Revolutionism, Nationalism, and
Statism. The Government imposes some restrictions on Muslim and other
religious groups and on Muslim religious expression in government
offices and state-run institutions, including universities.

"No law explicitly prohibits proselytizing or religious conversions;
however, many prosecutors and police regarded proselytizing and
religious activism with suspicion. Police occasionally prevented
Christians from handing out religious literature. The Government
reported 157 conversions, including 92 to Islam and 63 from Islam to a
different religion. Proselytizing is often considered socially
unacceptable; Christians performing missionary work were occasionally
beaten and insulted. If the proselytizers are foreigners, they may be
deported, but generally they are able to reenter the country. Police
officers may report students who meet with Christian missionaries to
their families or to university authorities."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Istanbul

"The everyday life of the Christians, particularly the Greeks and
Armenians, living in Istanbul changed significantly following the bitter
conflicts between these ethnic groups and the Turks during the Decline
of the Ottoman Empire, which began in the 1820s and continued for a
century. The conflicts reached their culmination in the decade between
1912 and 1922; during the Balkan Wars, the First World War and the
Turkish War of Independence. The city's Greek Orthodox community was
exempted from the population exchange between Greece and Turkey in 1923
following the establishment of the Turkish Republic. However, a series
of special restrictions and taxes during the years of the Second World
War (see, e.g., the wealth tax Varlık Vergisi), and the Istanbul Pogrom
of 1955 which caused the deaths of 15 Greeks and the injury of 32
others, greatly increased emigration from Istanbul to Greece. In 1964,
all Greeks without Turkish citizenship residing in Turkey (around
12,000[1]) were deported. Today, most of Turkey's remaining Greek and
Armenian minorities live in or near Istanbul. The number of the
Armenians in Istanbul today amount to approximately 40,000, while the
Greek community amounted to slightly more than 2,000 at the beginning of
the 21st century."

"The number of Istanbul's Italians decreased after the end of the
Ottoman Empire for several reasons. The Turkish Republic no longer
recognized the trade privileges that were given to the descendants of
the Genoese and Venetian merchants, and foreigners were no longer
allowed to work in Turkey in a wide number of sectors, including many
artisanships, in which numerous Istanbulite Italians used to work. The
Varlık Vergisi (Wealth Tax) of the World War II years, which imposed
higher tariffs on non-Muslims and foreigners in Turkey, also played an
important role in the migration of Istanbul's Italians to Italy—who
still live in the city, but in far fewer numbers when compared with the
early 20th century."

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On 08/09/2011 01:06 PM, ALG wrote:
>
> Očito imaš nešto osobno protiv muslimana pa izmišljaš ovakve bedastoće.

Apsolutno ništa. Pišem samo ono što na temelju proučavanja podataka
smatram istinitim. Nikakvih osobnih koloracija tu nema.

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On 08/09/2011 12:54 PM, Danijel Turina wrote:
> Ne, točno je tako kako sam rekao i dokazi upravo bodu u oči. Pogledaj si
> bilo koju islamsku zemlju pa mi reci gdje je tamo multikulturalnost.
> Tamo je izbor islam ili smrt. Doslovno to ide po sistemu da kako se
> netko uz Muhameda usudi imati drugu religiju, jel to znači da ne
> prihvaća Muhameda za proroka, a ako ne prihvaća, to je uvreda Muhamedu
> za što je kazna smrt. Eto to ti je islam. Ne "fundamentalistički", nego
> obični.

Bojim se da ljudi na zapadu malo znaju o tim stvarima pa treba poraditi
na informiranju.

http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Persecution_of_Non-Muslims

http://worldblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/11/29/5543912-christian-woman-faces-death-for-blasphemy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law_in_Pakistan

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/persecution.of.christians.increases.in.saudi.arabia.after.new.king.inaugurated/3779.htm

"India?s Ambassador to Saudi Arabia has sent a circular to Indian
nationals, warning them that Indians are increasingly being detained for
engaging in religious activities, according to Indo-Asia News.

The ambassador advised them not to preach in any way or organise prayer
meetings in private homes. He also told the Indian government to warn
everyone leaving for the Saudi Kingdom to leave behind religious books,
Bibles, photos or icons, AsiaNews has reported."

"Practicing any religion other than Wahhabi fundamentalist Islam has
been outlawed by the Saudi government. All missionary activity or public
expression of faith, including possessing Bibles, holding a rosary,
wearing a crucifix, and praying in public, is banned, AsiaNews report.
The Muttawa makes sure the law is forcefully adhered to and AsiaNews
report that the use of violence and torture to impose the restrictions
has been used."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Bah%C3%A1'%C3%ADs

"The persecution of Baha'is is the religious persecution of Baha'is in
various countries, especially in Iran where the Baha'i Faith originated
and the location of one of the largest Baha'i populations in the world.
The origins of persecution stem from a variety of Baha'i teachings
inconsistent with traditional Islamic belief, including the finality of
Muhammad's prophethood, and places Baha'is outside the Islamic faith.
Thus Baha'is are seen as apostates from Islam, and, according to some,
must choose between repentance and death."

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